View Full Version : shiah and sunni marriage
asalamu alaikum brothers and sisters. i am a 17 year old palestinian young man living in the united states. i have a question. as a sunni, i am curious to know if it is haram to marry a shiah girl? yes yes i know. i hate the sects as well. i think it is sad how muslims concentrate on their differences, which are mainly a result of political disputes, and instead do not focus on what islam is really about, peace and oneness with allah swt. we must all settle our differences and stop referring to ourselves as "sunni" or "shiah" and instead refer to ourselves as MUSLIMS. because that is what we all are. it hurts my heart to hear my parents tell me "nabeel, u cannot marry a shiah girl." what if i fall in love with one? (i have...but that is a whole new post in and of itself lol) if it is haram for a sunni to marry a shiah, why? if it is not haram, how can i, if i one day marry a shiah, make sure that the differences between my wife and i do not ruin our marriage. and if i do marry a shiah, what will my children be? i love islam, i love all muslims. and to have to ask this question hurts me, but i guess it is a must. subhanallah, what i love about islam is even though there are sects...look at hizballah...and look at the palestinians. hizballah is shiah, but they still help their sunni palestinian brothers in need of help. mashallah i love being a muslim. yet even though, the sects still bother me. all i know is i am a muslim, i love all the prophets of allah swt, and i love the quran and all those who helped the prophets spread the message. may allah bless you all, and i look forward to someone's reply. thanks. byee.
kojax girl
28-03-2002, 03:04
asalamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu...
i am writing in response to this so-called "MAN" who was asking about sunni's marrying shiah's. listen you big freak...i don't know who you are or where you are from but you really irritate me...why must you asking INCREDIBLY DUMB questions?? why waste our time by posting stupid questions?? yullah - TELL ME!!!! who do you think you are, some smart guy or something?? for the love of god almighty!!
hehehe...just kidding nabeel...
here's my honest response hun, as long as two people believe in allah swt and are good muslims and have the same basic ideals, then nothing else should matter. it's hard enough to find "mr" or "miss right" in this world...why put up further barriers to prevent you from finding happiness??
<3 <3 <3
KT
thanks sister. i appreciate your KINDNESS and help, lol :) yeah that makes me feel better...i just hope what you say is true. i do think it is ridiculous...this whole shiah sunni thing...i mean allah warned against sects in the quran, and look at us muslims, we still differentiate amongst ourselves. it is sad...and inshallah one day if i am blessed i will meet a woman, and if she is shiah, i will teach my children to be MUSLIM and not part of sects that allah warned against. yullah if anyone else has any advice, feel free to send it my way. shookrane to all.
nabeel
Assalaamu alaikum.
Shia, sunni, they are all claiming adherance to the same basic religion. If you will refer to the Quran, you will find and know that the directive for the man in marriage is that he is permitted (or rather even directed) to marry either of the believing women (i.e. Muslims) or from the people of the book (i.e. Christians and/or Jews). And since shias technically come under the category of believers, i.e. Muslims, then that is permissable as far as Allah's commandments are concerned.
Your parents and their wishes and their advice and their agreement is another matter entirely.
And...the point that you have mentioned...that you are already in love with a shia woman...is still another matter as well.
As for any children which come from such a marriage (sunni-shia marriage)...they will be muslims. Period. And that is the way that it should be. Even the parents...should put aside the sunni-shia differences.
The basics of Islam are available for all to find and know...within the Quran and the hadith of our beloved prophet(SAAW)...and those who make it more difficult and binding by adding on this or that imposition of religious practice or additional celebrations...well, then they are only overburdening themselves, as well as possibly even going astray from the straight and simple path of the deen.
Allah knows best.
Lulua.
Peace to all members!!
Mashallah, the words of the sister are good and helpful to anyone here..
BUT..
"..since shias technically come under the category of believers, i.e. Muslims,..."
This, not causing any confusion or dispute here, just want to post some 'opinons' from the scholars regarding shias. I hope after reading them, then we will see what or who shias are, and what conditions, if are taken, like rejecting or labeling some of the sahabahs as non-muslims, what is the result...
So, this is not confusing the above question, but giving light to what the sister said, and if i am not mistaken, there is only one group which have been accepted by the muslims, and the rest are not considered muslims.
So the question, i ask is, which of the 'shia' is the person? and love might seem, so wonderful, but if the person who you are marrying, does not accept the sahabahs as whom they are, and if the person follows the ways of the iranY (milk)shiekh? then the details will provide a good answer...
I will only say, if the person accepts the sahabahs and follows what the quran and rasul said, then, there lies no problem. But if the second part of the foundation is wrong, then what do you make of that person, if the second part of the sahadah is.....? then we will see how love helps you on the day of qimah...?!
Read the following...ohh a lot from me, but now i am very busy...
..............
- Imaam ash-Shaafi`ee
On one occasion ash-Shaafi`ee said concerning the Shi`ites, "I have not seen among the heretics a people more famous for falsehood than the Raafidite Shi`ites." [Ibn Taymeeyah, Minhaaj as-Sunnah an-Nabawiyyah, 1/39]On another occasion he said, "Narrate knowledge from
everyone you meet except the Raafidite Shi`ites, because they invent Hadeeths and adopt them as part of their religion." [Ibid, p. 38]
- Imaam Maalik
Once Maalik was asked about them and he replied, "Do not speak to them nor narrate from them, for surely they are liars." [Minhaaj as-Sunnah, 1/37] During a class of Imaam Maalik, it was mentioned that the Raafidite Shi`ites curse the Sahaabah. In reply, he quoted the
Quranic verse, "Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah and those with him are harsh with the disbelievers and gentle among themselves. So that the disbelievers may become enraged with them." He then said, "Whoever becomes enraged when the Sahaabah are mentioned is one about whom the verse speaks." [Tafseeer al-Qurtubee, Soorah al-Fath; Editors note: That is, anyone who is enraged by the mention of the Sahaabah is a disbeliever, because the verse says, "the disbelievers may become enraged with them (Sahaabah)."]
Abu Zur`ah ar-Raazee
This great scholar was quoted as saying, "If you see someone degrade any of the companions of the Prophet, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, know that he is a disbeliever. Because the Prophet, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, was real, what he brought was the truth and all of it was conveyed to us by the way of the Sahaabah. What those disbelievers wish to do is to cast doubt on the reliability of our narrators in order to invalidate the Quraan and the Sunnah. Thus the
disbelievers are the ones most deserving defamation."
Al-Qaadee Abu Ya`laa
It was reported that Abu Ya`laa said, "The position of jurists concerning one who curses the Sahaabah, believing that such an act is permissible, is that he has committed an act of disbelief. If he curses them but does not believe that cursing them is permissible, then he is guilty of immorality, and not disbelief." [Ibn Taymeeyah, as-Sawaarim al-Maslool, p. 569]
So... i hope these bring some discussion or help us understand, the concept of 'some' shias and marrying someone is very tricky with the explanation from the above respected scholars..
Carry on.. and dont mind me.!
Salam to all
With the similar theme to the above theme...!!
Some posts required!!
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QUESTION;
How many shia's cult are being in practice in the present world? What are the diffrences between them and which parts of the world do the belong? Are all kafir?
ANSWER;
We are aware of the un-Islamic beliefs of the mainstream Shi'a sect, the Jafaris.
If any other Shi'a denomination share similar beliefs as that of the Ja'fari
Shi'as, they too will be regarded as Kaafirs.
and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best
Mufti Ebrahim Desai
Assalaamu alaikum.
Thankyou, my brothers...for the fine references of scholarly fatwas in regards this question.
And, although the fatawas are seemingly based on strong knowledge and understanding of the deen...still it is a difficult if not impossible thing to do...judging someone by labeling them as not muslim, when in fact they claim Islam and state the basic shahadah of Islam. No disrespect to the prominent scholars...just an observation and belief of mine, that it is not for anyone to judge anyone else of his/her faith. That is something for Allah only, and truly the power of that judgement lies with Allah only.
That said, I would like to mention something which I had thought of at the time of my original response, but became rather sidetracked and did not include in my answer.
Marriage itself is quite a serious state of relationship, and something more serious than to base merely on affection or mutual love at the time. The original affection and seeming love at the beginning many times dies away or at the very least withers to an extent after a time of marriage. Even for two people who are of similar or even same beliefs. The infatuation of the love at the beginning is not truly enough to hold them together.
There needs to be an underlying basis of mutual respect for one another, for each other's beliefs and much kindness as well. This many times is missing in couples who come from conflicting backgrounds or different beliefs.
The brother asking this question has made remark that he is already in love with the woman who he desires to marry...someone of different beliefs than he and his family. That is alright..but how did this love become? I have already asked that question. But let me also say that true love is something that develops over a time of living and interacting with each other. It is not something truly found at first sight, or merely from meeting each other at school or at work. And it is also not that which many young people today wrongly interprete from their casual and non-islamically-permitted interactions with the opposite sex. True love is something which is only attainable with the permission of Allah, and it is truly a blessing indeed. When Allah makes two different ppl to love and care for each other as they care for themselves or even more. To love someone of the other sex before marriage is delving into something of the questionable at the very least. Surely Allah knows best.
And, in the cases of the marriages that do not last, which eventually end up in divorce, the sacrifice of that marriage is the resulting children. Whether they end up with their mother or their father, or even in a home of another relative for any reason...they are the loser. The adults will eventually get over the loss and the heartbreak, but the children are forever effected.
It is because of this that serious thought must be given before entering into any marriage...as well as of course (and second to)consulting the Highest Authority and Source of Guidance...Allah.
May Allah guide us all to that which is best.
Lulua.
Thank you all for responding to my question. I am a 17 year old muslim brother from palestine, but I live in the United States. Lulua asked in her latest response about whether the love I have for this girl was something of first sight or developed over time. Let me explain...I have alot to say that I did not say, and may Allah forgive me for not making this clear from the start.
I am a senior in high school right now. As a muslim man, I never allowed myself to get close to girls. For the respect of my deen and allah, I did not allow myself to be distracted by the distractions in the american school system, such as drugs, sex, beer, etc. And I still dont. But this year, I met a nice persian girl in my biology class. She and I became friends in October, and everything was great between us. We became really good friends and I found myself all of a sudden feeling something different. I cannot explain it, but I began to feel for this girl like I never felt for anyone before. Yes she was shiah, but I looked beyond that. I realized that this girl made me happy...she was not only my best friend...my sister in islam...she was something more to me.
Well in January, after 4 months of a great friendship, this girl revealed to me that she liked me like she had never liked somebody before. May allah forgive me, but I was blinded by the Shaitan. I allowed myself to get in a relationship with this girl...and for 2 weeks, everything was fine. But one night i realized what i was doing was haram...yes she was my first kiss and nothing more than that...but something inside of me did not feel right. So I told the girl that I thought it was best for us to remain friends.
Now it is nearly April. I love this girl...I love her for the sake of Allah...but now I am afraid. She tells me that she and I will never be more than friends...and it hurts me brothers and sisters. I have written her a letter...I have not read it to her yet...but I want to make it clear to her that I did not "let her go" because I did not like her...I let her go because of Islam. I cannot do wrong. I cant. I cannot live with myself knowing I am doing something against the will of allah. I want to tell this girl that I feel for her as more than a sister in Islam...but that I wish we just agree to see how things go and place faith in the hands of allah and that when i am done college and have a job that she will be the first muslim girl i will ask for. Brothers and sisters, i know I am young. I know. No one has to tell me that. But I know that what I feel inside of me is different...I cannot explain it, but it is. I have made prayer to Allah...and I realize now that I have nothing to fear but him. That I should not fear approaching this girl face to face...which i have never done since i "let her go"...and tell her how i feel. May Allah forgive me for allowing the Shaitan to overcome me and make me lose my mind...but now I have a great chance to mend things with me and her, and perhaps things will even be better than b4 one day. All i know now is that I will not allow myself to be romantically involved with a girl ever again until I can be serious and get married. Now i know why allah forbid relations b4 marriage...it just leads to broken hearts and fractured friendships. May Allah bless you all for reading this young palestinians problems :) thank you and I appreciate any advice on this issue, especially from the sisters, because god knows muslim men do not understand their muslim sisters :) just kidding. well hopefully I can get a response soon...may allah bless all those u love. take care. wasalaam.
Assalamu Alaikum to the Muslims here !
I have skimmed through what everyone said, and not thoroughly read what was said.
Sister Lulua said:
" Assalaamu alaikum.
Thankyou, my brothers...for the fine references of scholarly fatwas in regards this question.
And, although the fatawas are seemingly based on strong knowledge and understanding of the deen...still it is a difficult if not impossible thing to do...judging someone by labeling them as not muslim, when in fact they claim Islam and state the basic shahadah of Islam."
Dear sister Lulua, some Muslim scholars have passed fatwaas of kufr against certain Shia sects because of their beliefs.
I am sure you are aware that there is an ijmaa amongst Ahlus Sunnah Wal Jammah, that anyone who curses Aisha (RA), the wife of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), is a kaafir. I would like to stress once again, that all Sunni scholars agree on this fact. There is scholarly consensus,i.e. ijmaa, on this fact.
And, the truth is that some Shias, do indeed curse Aisha (RA), Astagfarullah.
This fact, i confirmed from a Shia himself. In case anyone doubts what i am saying, i am willing to provide the email address of that person, so you can ask him. He belongs to the Ithnaa Ashari sect.
They also curse the Sahabaah, Astagfarullah.
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) is reported to have said:
"Allah, Allah! Fear Him with regard to my Companions! Do not make them targets after me! Whoever loves them loves them with his love for me; and whoever hates them hates them with his hatred for me. Whoever bears enmity for them, bears enmity for me; and whoever bears enmity for me, bears enmity for Allah. Whoever bears enmity for Allah is about to perish."
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) also said:
"Anyone who curses my Companions has the curse of Allah on him, and of the angels, and of all people. Allah will not accept any exchange nor compensation from him."
Allah Almighty said:
"Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves. Thou (O Muhammad) seest them bowing and falling prostrate (in worship), seeking bounty from Allah and (His) acceptance. The mark of them is on their foreheads from the traces of prostration. Such is their likeness in the Torah and their likeness in the Gospel - like as sown corn that sendeth forth its shoot and strengtheneth it and riseth firm upon its stalk, delighting the sowers - that He may enrage the disbelievers with (the sight of) them. Allah hath promised, unto such of them as believe and do good works, forgiveness and immense reward." (48:29)
al-Qurtubi commented on this verse in his Jami` li ahkam al-qur'an (1994 Cairo ed. 16:283-286) thus:
Abu `Urwa al-Zubayri narrated: We were with Malik ibn Anas when they mentioned a certain man who would find fault with the Companions of the Messenger of Allah. When he heard this, Malik recited the verse: "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him. . ." until he reached the words "delighting the sowers - that He may enrage the disbelievers with (the sight of) them." (48:29) Then Malik said: "Whoever among the people has become one who harbors spite towards any one of the Prophet's Companions, this verse has targeted and reached him." al-Khatib mentioned it.
Mufti Ibrahim Desai, has passed a fatwaa of kufr against the Ithnaa Asharis, because he is a Hanafi scholar. Some of the Hanafi scholars have done this, i.e. passed a fatwaa of kufr against the Shia, based in part or in whole on the hadith from Jabir narrated by Daylami and Ibn Asakir: "Love of Abu Bakr and `Umar is iman (or: Sunna), and hatred of them is disbelief, and love of the Ansar is iman, and hatred of them is disbelief, and love of the Arabs is iman, and hatred of them is disbelief. Whoever insults my Companions, Allah's curse is on him, and whoever protects me in my Companions, I will be his guardian on the Day of Rising."
Though it must be noted that Imam Al Suyuti declared this hadith weak in his Jami` al-saghir (#3668).
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) also said:
"Whoever loves `Umar loves me. Whoever hates `Umar hates me."
Sahl ibn `Abd Allah at-Tustari said: "Anyone who does not respect the Messenger's Companions nor gives weight to his commands (to respect them) does not believe in him."
Note that, as far as i remember, and Allah knows best, at Tustari was praised by Imam al Ghazzali in his book Foundations of Islamic belief. Though i am unsure of this, and can't remember perfectly. And Allah knows best.
Wassalam,
Asif.
Salam to all!
I understand the role of love and the other issues, with one brother with another person.
But i posted, the fatwa, and i will post with this message, some more. I am stressing this issue, for the fact that, yes, someone might 'fall' in love and the person could be a shia or a christian...but the issue is, shias are not muslims....those who, as the brother asif pointed out..those who restort to slandering the mother of the believers and the sahabahs.
So the issue, as the scholars have explained. Shias are not muslims, there belief, if it is different to the 'main-'stream muslims...if noth are not the same, then how can they be muslims?.
the belief of the muslims have been explained and explained and those who resort to call themselve shias and construct a different belief in itself..shows that they are wrong.
Below i have gathered more fatwas from the site of mufti ebrahim desai. I hope the brother who is thinking of getting married reads them and thinks about it.
I am not be harsh or too hard, but belief is the thing that we stand upon and it is the thing that makes us 'best' of nations, so if that certain (lucky) sister is a person who would like to unserstand and read up on the belief that we should have, then inshallah get married and invite us too.
Explain to her the 'belief' and if she agrees then subhnallah!!> but if she slanders or resorts to cursing or not accepting aisha or the other sahabahs..then...its up to you and marriage is something very dangerous in that stage.
Below......read and reflect!
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Q>
Why are shia’a different?
Asalamu alakum. Why are they considered kafireen? They believe in Allah and his messenger ( p.b.u.h), they prey 5 times a day. How is it haram to merry one if they believe in Allah and his messenger (p.b.u.h)? from what I have been told, Allah loves those who love him and believe in the prophet…..shia’a love Allah and believe in the prophet. Their women wear hejab, they fast the holy month. I have talked to one and they say the only difference is they prey with their hands to the side and that they believe in safe Ali( what is that). Please help me understand why they are considered kafireen if they made shihaddah. Allah ma’ak
A>
UNBRIDGEABLE DIVIDE
-----------------------------------
The protracted contrariety between Islam and Shi'ism is but a clear
reflection of fundamental differences between the two. The only common denominator between Islam and Shi'ism is the Islamic Kalimah. The rest of Shi'ism has very little in common with mainstream Islam. The unbridgeable divide between the two is entrenched in some of the core fundamentals of this sect, such as:
* THE TWELVE IMAAMS
Imaamah is a divine station like Nubuwwat. This implies that Sunnis, who do not believe in Imaamah, are unbelievers. According to their beliefs, Allah had chosen twelve men to succees Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam). The twelfth Imaam however disappeared at the age of five. He is believed to be the awaited Mahdi.
* THE STATUS OF THE IMAAMS
The Imaams possess more knowledge than the Ambiyaa. They are superior to the Ambiyaa and the entire creation. The Imaams can bring the dead back to life. No knowledge of the heavens and the earth is hidden from them.
* THE INTERPOLATION OF THE NOBLE QUR'AN
The Qur'an is incomplete and distorted in its present form. This tenet had been explicity propounded by the classical scholars of Shi'ism, but frugally denied by the contemporary scholars.
* VILIFICATION AND APOSTASY OF THE SAHAABA
The Sahaaba were guilty of wilfully distorting and corrupting the Deen of Muhammad (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam). They turned renegade after the demise of Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) except the immediate household of Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam).
* THE PERMISSIBILITY OF MUT'A
* VIRTUES OF TAQIYYA
Islam and Shi'ism are two parallel streams of thought that can never
converge. They are as distinct from each other, as is Islam to the
Ahlul-Kitaab.To ignore these differences is to ignore the stark reality.
The often repeated hallowed call for "Muslim Unity" simply serves as a smokescreen, behind which Shi'a missionaries penetrate Muslim societies. Any attempt to resist this imposition is branded as "divisive". Would it be divisive to protect Islam from a sect that inherently debases the Qur'an, the Ambiyaa, and the Sahaaba? Unity can only be forged on the basis of Aqeedah (belief). To label these differences as 'hair splitting issues' is to undermine the sanctity of the Qur'an, the Ambiyaa and the Sahaaba unity at the cost of the Qur'an is tantamount to blasphemy.
The constitution of our country guarantees religious freedom. The Shi'as therefore have the right to propagate their beliefs. However, they need to come out of the closet and do so under the banner of Shi'ism.
Issued by: UUCSA
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Q>
Why Shia abuse the Sahaba-e-karam? Following are some beleifs in detail which Shia belive about sahab-e-karam?
They always abuses sahab-e-karam except Hazrat Ali (radiallahu anhu). They said that hazrat Abu Bakr (radiallahu anhu) cried in Gaar-e-Hira when both Our Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) and Abu Bakr (radiallahu anhu) were hidden there,because they want to arrest Our Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) (NaoozBillah).And such beiefs are also with hazrat Umar (radiallahu anhu) and Hazrat Usman (radiallahu anh). Please tell me.
A>
EXTRACT FROM SHAYKH HUZAIFI'S KHUTBAH
How can there be any similarity, any bond between Islam and Yahudiyyat (the Jewish faith), when Islam is exceptional, with its purity, light, brilliance, nobility, justice, toleration, magnanimity, high morality, equally for man or Jinn, while Yahudiyyat is a collection of materialism and narrow-mindedness, bears malice towards humanity, is steeped in moral degradation, greed and covetousness? So how can there be any link between Islam and Yahudiyyat? Can any Muslim tolerate the aspersion cast upon the pious, pure character of Hadhrat Maryam Álayhas salaam by the Jews? Can the Muslims bear the presence of the Jews who call Hadhrat `Esa Álayhis salaam (Christ) the son of a whore? Na`oozubilLah. Allah forbid! And on this account how can there be any link between the Holy Qur'an and Talmud, the holy book of the Satanish Jews?
Similarly there is no similarity between Christianity and Islam. Islam is a pure and clean religion believing in the oneness of Allah, in Tauheed. It is pure justice and a blessing. It is complete Sharee`ah, the revealed law, whereas Christianity is a deviation from the right path. The misled Christians hold the belief of Trinity-Father, Son, Holy Ghost. Christianity claims that Christ is God and the son of God.
And how can there be a reconciliation between the Ahlus Sunnah and shiah? The Ahlus Sunnah are those who learnt and protected the Qur'aan al Kareem, who preserved and protected the Sunnah of Rasulullah ((Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam)), those whom Allah Ta'ala has used to protect His Deen, and they made Jihaad in the way of Islam. And history bears ample testimony to this.
The Raafidhah (shiahs) are those who curse the Sahaabah and attempt to destroy Islam. The Sahaabah Radhiyallaahu Ánhum are those that transmitted the Deen to us. If we had to cast aspersions at the integrity of the Sahaabah, it will imply the destruction of the Deen. How can there be a reconciliation between the Ahlus Sunnah and the Raafidhah (shiahs) while they swear and abuse the three Khulafaa ur Raashidah? If they had any intelligence then they would realise that their abuse is in fact an abuse of Rasululllah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam). Hadhrat Abu Bakr and Umar Radhiyallaahu Ánhuma are the fathers-in-law of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam). They were his close confidants during his lifetime, and his close neighbours after his demise. Who can achieve this honour? Who can achieve this honour? They took part in Jihaad with Rasulullah (Sallallaahu
Álayhi Wasallam) in all the Jihaad campaigns. These facts should be
sufficient to dispel the false accusations of the shiahs.
Hadhrat Uthmaan Radhiyallaahu Ánhu was husband to two of the daughters of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam). Allah Ta'ala will not choose for his beloved Rasool except the best of men, and the best of companions. This was the relationship between Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) and the three Khulafaa ur Raashideen. He never said that these three are the enemies of Islam, and never warned against these three, as the shiahs claim.
If fact swearing at these three is an attack against Hadhrat Ali
Radhiyallaahu Ánhu. Hadhrat Ali Radhiyallaahu Ánhu gave Hadhrat Abu Bakr Radhiyallaahu Ánhu the Bay'át (oath of allegiance) in the Musjid (openly); and he (Hadhrat Ali Radhiyallaahu Ánhu) got his daughter Ummu Kulthoom married to Hadhrat Umar Radhiyallahu unhu; he took the Bay'át at the hands of Hadhrat Uthmaan Radhiyallaahu Ánhu, was his minister, close friend and beloved one. Would Hadhrat Ali Radhiyallaahu Ánhu give his daughter to a kaafir, or would he give the bay'á to a kaafir? Subhaanallah, this is indeed a great slander.
Their curse of Hadhrat Mu'aawiyah (Radhiyallah Anhu) is in fact an attack against Hadhrat Hassan Radhiyallaahu Ánhu, who accepted the khilaafat of Hadhrat Mu'aawiyah Radhiyallaahu Ánhu, and whom many prominent Sahaabah accepted. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) praised him on many occasions. Would the grandson of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) accept the khilaafat of a kaafir? Subhaanallah, this is indeed a great slander.
When they say that Hadhrat Ali and Hassan Radhiyallaahu Ánhuma were forced to do so, it displays their (shiahs') lack of intelligence. This is an insult to the two of them, a most vile insult.
And how is it that they curse Ummul Mu'mineen Hadhrat 'Aaisha {Radhiyallahu anha}, whereas Allah Ta'ala declares in the Qur'aan that she is Ummul Mu'mineen (Mother of the Believers).
Allah Ta'ala says:
The Prophet has a greater right over the Mu'mineen than they have over themselves, and his Wives are their (the Mu'muneen's) Mothers.
Therefore there is no doubt that those who curse her, she is not a mother unto them (they are not Mu'mineen). Would any person curse his own mother? Rather he would love her dearly.
How can there ever be a reconciliation between the Ahlus Sunnah and the Raafidhah (shiahs), when they believe Khomeini, the imaam of deviation, to be sinless. They assert that he is the deputy of their concocted Mahdi. Since they regard their imaams to be sinless, and since in the absence of the principle the deputy has the same status, they assert Khomeini to be sinless.
And one form of Baatil only assists another. And one form of Baatil only assists another.
And the Ahle Bayt are free and absolved from their (shiah's) beliefs. The proofs substantiating the falsehood of the beliefs of the shiahs are innumerable.
As far as we, the Ahlus Sunnah, are concerned, we will not draw closer to them a hair's breath, or even less. They are a greater harm to Islam than even the Yahood and Nasaarah. It is incumbent on all Muslims to be wary of them and be on guard against them.
Allah Ta'ala says:
They are your enemies, so beware of them. Allah Ta'ala declares war against them. Where will they find refuge?
The shiahs are the followers of Ibn Saba, the yahoodi, and of Abu Lu'lu-ah, the majoosi (fire-worshiper). Thus, O Muslims, it is necessary for us to distinguish our Aqeedah, and to love those whom Allah Ta'ala loves, and hate that which Allah Ta'ala hates, to bring about unity amongst the Muslims, to be one strong united hand. The enemies of Islam have united in their false beliefs, to fight against Islam. This applies whether the enemies are of old or new.
Allah Taãla says:
"Never will the Jews and Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion."
And He says:
"And they will go on fighting you until they turn you away from your faith if they could."
How can there be any similarity, any bond between Islam and Yahudiyyat, (the Jewish faith) when Islam is exceptional, with its purity, light, brilliance, nobility, justice, toleration, magnanimity, high morality, equally for man or Jinn, and Yahudiyyat is, a collection of materialism and
narrow-mindedness, bears malice towards humanity, is steeped in moral
degradation, greed and covetousness.
--------------
Integrity of the Prophet's Companions
By By Muhammad Alkhider
Some people intentionally or unintentionally do refer to the meaning of Integrity and the concept of Infallibility as synonymous, although the difference between them is crystal-clear. As such, they think that attributing virtuousness to the companions of the Holy Prophet necessitates their infallibility. What a grave mistake!
Integrity of the Prophet's companions means that: they were neither
hypocrites, liars, lewd, immoral nor infidels. Besides, they were righteous believers who would err sometimes and correct their mistakes thereafter. They committed mistakes after which they hastened to repent and seek forgiveness from Allah Almighty. They obeyed God, the Most High, and expected His acceptance of their acts of devotion without an iota of doubt.
Infallibility requires of a person to be exalted from committing sins or perpetuating shortcomings. Both his mind and body should be immaculate of blemishes and shortcomings that can easily defame his rank and traduce his status.
The difference between Integrity and Infallibility is crystal-clear in Islam. The Sunni Muslims do refer to the companions of the Holy Prophet as straightforward, virtuous and honest but not infallible. Impeccability according to the belief of the Sunni Muslims is only attributed to Prophets and Messenger of God Almighty.
Regarding the source of integrity and the question whether it is a
Philosophical theory or rather an Islamic fact that a host of texts has proved authentic, the answer is as follows:
A pondering and reflecting look at the Holy Qur'an and a study that Muslims render to the Book of God and the authentic traditions of the Holy Prophet (PBUH) is able to provide a convincing answer to the aforementioned question. Allah, the Holy One, says in the Holy Qur'an: "Allah's good pleasure was on the believers when they swore Fealty to thee under the Tree: He knew what was in their hearts, and He sent down Tranquility to them: and He rewarded them with a speedy victory." (48: 18)
God Almighty in the above-mentioned verse explained to His messenger and the entire believing folk that His pleasure was on the believers, men and women, who plighted fealty to Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him). He informed his messenger furthermore that He knew what was concealed in their hearts regarding faith in Him and truthfulness. Hence, He sent down tranquility, peace, calm and sense of security and confidence to them. This suffices as testimony from God Almighty regarding the veracity of the companions' faith, their truthfulness and sincerity. It has been proven that the messenger of God (PBUH) said: "No one among those who swore their fealty to me under the tree will be consigned to Hell except the owner of the red camel." (Related by At-Tirmidhiy in "Al-Mana'qib [Virtues of the Companions], and Muslim in the same titled book)
The man who was doomed to Hell-fire according to the above-mentioned Hadith, was among the arch-hypocrites of Madinah called Al-Jaddu bin Qais.
The number of the companions who swore their fealty to the Prophet (PBUH) was 1,400. According to other traditions it reached 1,500. God Almighty testified to their sincere and truthfulness and confirmed to His messenger that there was no grain of hypocrisy in their hearts except one man. The messenger of God (PBUH) eventually revealed his name to the companions. His name was Al-Jaddu bin Qais. He did not swear his fealty to the messenger of God as did the companions under the Tree of Allah's Pleasure. Allah, Exalted in Might, says in the Holy Qur'an: "Not equal among you are those who spent (freely) and fought before the victory (with those who did so later). Those are higher in rank than those who spent (freely) and fought afterwards. But to all has Allah promised a goodly (reward.) (57: 10)
God, the Most High, in the above-mentioned verse, promised the companions who spent freely before and after the speedy victory of the liberation of Makkah, a goodly reward. Moreover, He passed a verdict regarding the ones He promised a goodly reward, that they would be safe from the torment of the Hell-fire on the Resurrection Day. He says in the Holy Qur'an: "Those for whom the good (record) from Us has gone before, will be removed far therefrom. Not the slightest sound will they hear of hell. What their souls desired, in that will they dwell. The Great Terror will bring them no grief." (21: 101-103) Allah Almighty also says in the Holy Qur'an: "Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah." (3: 110)
However, it is incredible for a nation (People) that Allah Almighty has referred to as the best of people evolved for mankind, as testimony from Him to be as the Shiite Adherents and Sources maintain! For they say: "The emigrants (from Makkah to Madinah) and the Ansa'r (those who welcomed, helped and hosted the Prophet and his companions who came from Makkah) all of them recanted their religion except three." (Al-Kaafiy, 2/244)
Had it been true that they were really as described by the Shiite Sources, Allah Almighty would have not praised and placed them in a lofty rank in the aforementioned verse and in many others. The messenger of God (PBUH) says:
"Prophet Noah (on him be peace) is going to be summoned by God Almighty on the Resurrection Day. He will say: "Here I am at your service O my Lord!" Then God Almighty will ask him: "Did you convey the message?" Noah's response will be: "Yes." Then God Almighty will ask Noah's people: "Did he convey the message?" They will apparently say: "No Warner came to us." Then God Almighty will ask Noah (Peace be upon him): "Who will testify that you conveyed the message?" Noah will obviously say: "Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and his people (followers)." Then the followers of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) will unanimously testify that Noah (on him be peace) delivered the message entrusted to him by God Almighty."
Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) informed us of the aforementioned situation in his interpretation of the following verse: "Thus have We made you an Ummah (nation, people) justly balanced, that ye might be witnesses over yourselves." (2: 143)
Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) in the context of his interpretation of the
aforementioned verse said: "To be justly balanced means: to be
straightforward." Related by Al-Bukha'riy
Thus the messenger of God (PBUH) confirmed the non-shaky integrity of his honest, truthful and sincere companions.
................................
Q>
Can a Sunni man can marry a Shia girl?
A>
It is not permissible for a Sunni male to marry a Shi'a girl.
and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best
Mufti Ebrahim Desai
the link!>
http://www.islam.tc/ask-imam/view.php?q=188
.....................
This is a good link...that explains alot...
Check it out!!
http://www.angelfire.com/ct/ibnhajar/index.html
.............
Sadiq...more next time.......
Muslihah
31-03-2002, 11:26
As-Salamu-Alaikum Wr Wb,
I agree that to marry someone from the Shia sect is not permissible.Even if it is, I do not like it and will never encourage it because such marriage can affect on the children.To nabal, I advise not to conclude that what you are feeling is love.You didn't mix with girls from young and it could probably be attraction, which is just nature.Allah do not forbide relationship before marriage because it brings to heartbreaks, there are still marriage couples that break up.So consider, are you going to end up like them? Are you sure that your future marriage will be able to last long? You better think about it.
Have you ever wonder what is the meaning of this life.We live for the 'Akhirah' and this world is just temporary.We are like travellers to the next world.Our good deeds will be our saviour.Therefore make sure you do anything in the cause of Allah, to raise up the religion of Islam.Islam do not encourage divorce though it is permissible under certain reasons.A halal practice that is dislike by Allah is divorce.
Choose a good wife who has much knowledge on Islam.Look for the one who has the same level as yourself or lower to avoid conflicts.Show some respect to the sisters by meeting their parents if you feel for any one of them.Discuss with her parents and remember that marriage is a way to get to know your Muslims brothers and sisters from a different family.This is what we call bonding.
Lastly, I would like to stress out that meeting between a man and a woman is HARAM.May Allah forgive you for what you have done.If there is something to be talk about, the woman must be behind the veil and a 'mahram' accompanying her.
Muslihah
Dr Qaisar
08-04-2002, 22:40
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 08-04-02 AT 10:41 PM (GMT)]As-salaamu-alaikum ya muslimeen,
I was rather wondering if the Shias are to be considered as 'kafirs' (disbelievers) based on the scholarly 'fatwas', then why are Shias allowed to perform Hajj & Umrah every year and day?? We all know that since the coming of Islam, only Muslims are allowed to perform these pilgrimages. Surely, it is for Allah alone to judge who is a true believer!!!
Wa-salaam,
Dr.Qaisar
servant_of_Allah
09-04-2002, 23:10
In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
Assalamu Alaykum !
The Shia sect itself is divided into various sub-sects, example the Zaydis, the Ithnaa Asharis, the Bohras, the Ismailis, Nusayriyyah, etc.
Not all the sub-sects of the Shia sect are kaafirs. Some, very clearly are. And, some are not.
With regards to what the doctor asked. It isn't written on the passport that the person is a Shia. On the passport, as far as i am aware, all that is written is what is the person's religion.
I think it would be a very hectic and difficult task to identify which person is a Shia, and which not.
More importantly, there would be a political row with Iran, and we all know that Saudi Arabia and Iran don't enjoy best of relations. And, militarily, the Saudis are weaker.
Also, as i mentioned earlier, not all the sub-sects of the Shia sect are kaafirs. Some are, and some are not.
Wassalamu Alaykum,
servant of Allah.
Dr Qaisar
11-04-2002, 03:06
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 11-04-02 AT 03:09 AM (GMT)]In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
Wa-alaikumus-salaam, brother
>
>The Shia sect itself is divided into various sub-sects,
>example the Zaydis, the Ithnaa Asharis, the Bohras, the
>Ismailis, Nusayriyyah, etc.
>
>Not all the sub-sects of the Shia sect are kaafirs. Some,
>very clearly are. And, some are not.
This is true that the Shias are a divided lot but if one were to read the scholarly 'fatwas' regarding their status as kaafirs, they do not make any distinction between the sub-sects of the Shias. One would be constrained to conclude that it applies to Shias in general unless stated otherwise. The scholars would have to make this clear but I guess their fatwas pertain to the main sect, the Ithnaa Asharis. I do not know whether the other minor sects believe likewise. As in all matters, Allah knows best!
>
>With regards to what the doctor asked. It isn't written on
>the passport that the person is a Shia. On the passport, as
>far as i am aware, all that is written is what is the
>person's religion.
>
I think it would be a very hectic and difficult task to
>identify which person is a Shia, and which not.
>
Brother, this isn't a question of what is written on the passports but, rather, very fundamental to beliefs. But we do know where the majority of shias come from, say from Iran. Also passports are a requirement of this century; Shias have been performing the Hajj & Umra since ages, right from the earliest division. The point being that if you give them (or any group) the latitude of performing this most basic of duties for the sake of Allah, then you must also show the same latitude in all other matters; in other words, give them the 'benefit of doubt', so as to say. Is it not for Allah to judge?? Has Allah not promised us all in the Qur'an that He will judge on the Day of Judgement and inform us of our differences?? Why should we pre-empt the judgement?
>More importantly, there would be a political row with Iran,
>and we all know that Saudi Arabia and Iran don't enjoy best
>of relations. And, militarily, the Saudis are weaker.
This is the present day situation; the shias have been performing the pigrimages since the beginning. The Khalifas (here, I don't refer to the first 4) could have stopped them from doing so at a time when the shias were well organised & concentrated in Iran. But in the end, what purpose is solved by declaring the Shias as kafirs?? Can we punish them? It is only for Allah to either punish His slaves or to forgive them!!! Do we relieve ourselves of some burden?? And what about our own sins???
Wa-salaam,
Dr.Qaisar
Salam to all!
Mashallah! very good points from everyone.
I think, brother qaisar gave some interesting points. Yes, allah is the only judge and i like the idea of 'benefit of the doubt', but the thing that i want to get at is that, we also have a right for ourselves and for others to show which groups that are not correct.
There are alot in the world and the scholars as you have stated, shouuld expose them. For the benefit of the muslims and also non-muslims.
If you dont mind, brother, whats your view about the marriage, as that was the main theme of the thread?
Sadiq
Dr Qaisar
11-04-2002, 23:56
As-salaamu-alaikum, Bro.Sadiq
>i like the idea of 'benefit of
>the doubt', but the thing that i want to get at is that, we
>also have a right for ourselves and for others to show which
>groups that are not correct.
Yes bro., we do have the right to express ourselves and to show to others who are correct in their beliefs and practices as far as the 'sects' are concerned. In some of the cases, the matter is quite clear-cut, eg. the Ahmadiyyas or other groups claiming Prophethood after Prophet Mohammad (PBUH). Interestingly, the Al-Azhar University teaches a fifth school of thought ie. of the Shias (the main one) as part of their jurisprudence studies ('fiqh'). As we all know, there is not a single Muslim country in the world, past or present, that has explicitly declared the Shias as 'kaafirs' and outlawed them from the fold of Islam.
>If you dont mind, brother, whats your view about the
>marriage, as that was the main theme of the thread?
Coming to the original issue of marriage between Sunnis and Shias, it has been my personal experience to have known many marriages between such persons . No one has complained nor is it forbidden by law anywhere in the Muslim world. The Sharia does not prohibit it, so how can we prohibit it?? This is the stated opinion of the scholars of fiqh in many countries. I have not seen or heard of any record or testimony to the contrary. Therefore, I cannot agree with the contention that marriage between a Sunni and a Shia is prohibited on any grounds.
Wa-salaam,
Dr.Qaisar
Thankyou for your responses by dear brother, how are you by the way?
Just want to make this more intresting, the marriage might work out and there is no restriction by scholars as you have stated, but my concern is regarding the children.
When the children grow up, what will be the situation, as many shias have different schools and the sunni partner, might prefer the child to attend a different school, like for example the shia parent might want the child to go to a Hussainiyyah Centre, the other parent might want the child to attend a local mosque.
There is alot of tension, once into the marriage, but there are two opinons, one that, it is not allowed, the other, it is allowed, but the person has to consider the marriage, in regards to long term process...and emotions and of course the children have to be considered...
Quite interesting..topic..!
Sadiq
Assalaamu alaikum.
An interesting topic, indeed, and beginning to flare off in several directions differing from the beginning of the thread.
To get back to the basic question here...as Dr. Qaisar has so eloquently pointed out, there is no lawful or Islamically-based reason to prevent or prohibit such a union in marriage. Both parties will essentially be considered as muslims, inshaAllah.
Go back to the basic reason or consideration which classifies a person as a muslim...and that is one who submits to the will of Allah. Including the statement of the shahadah (words of witness).
This is the basic common underlying thread between the shias and the sunnis.
Since coming into Islam, I have always been awed as well as surprised and dissappointed at the many bad feelings eminating between the two groups of the sunnis and the shias. The many times common and frequent discord between the two groups is amazingly disheartening. So much to the point that I have begun to believe that the rift itself is nothing of a development of the differing views of muslims themselves, but rather of an instigation by those who are the enemies of Islam, and who have eminated into the ranks between the muslims.
Even at the beginning of the drift apart into the shia preference, the separation from the sunni majority, there was still a basic unity among the muslims. And before that, during the rule of our beloved prophet(SAAW) and the following years of the khilafah of his companions, there was differences of methodology of worship and going about daily business, yet there was a basic and underlying unity.
In recent past, that unity has disseminated, and it is apparent to me that it is due to the work and wishes of the enemies of Islam. For, as the old saying goes 'there is strength in unity and numbers'. And, evidently, as long as the muslism are not united, as long as they remain divided and arguing and fighting amongst themselves, there will be no unity, and therefore there will be no strength.
Therefore, it is apparent that we all overcome our own prejudices against one another, and learn to unite and cooperate for the cause of Allah. For surely if we do not, Allah will do away with us now as He has done of generations of the past, and replace us with those who will be more capable of attacking the task at hand.
We should also take the example of our beloved prophet(SAAW) and his companions and the previous generations of great and pious muslims, and refrain from extracting and imposing judgement on anyone. As long as they claim Islam, and take upon themselves to perform the various tasks required of muslims (i.e. perform the hajj or umra or other various deeds), then who are we to attempt to judge them and attempt to claim that they are outside of the fold of Islam? Judgement is for Allah...and He has warned us not to be too judgmental of those who claim to be muslims (i.e. not to create scandal and accuse another muslim of kufr).
May Allah grant us all more beneficial knowledge, the wisdom to use that knowledge, and apply it in our daily lives, and may He lead us to that which is best.
Lulua.
khalid sawani
21-04-2002, 15:41
asslamoalykum muslims
nabeel is asking silly question AND printing long stories afterwards
It is not allowed in islam to make boy friends and girl friends ,
Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“… Wed them with the permission of their own folk and give them their mahr (dowry) according to what is reasonable; they should be chaste, not adulterous, nor taking boyfriends…” [al-Nisaa’ 4:25]
“Made lawful to you this day are al-tayyibaat [all kinds of halaal (lawful) foods…]. The food of the People of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) is lawful to you and yours is lawful to them. (Lawful to you in marriage) are chaste women from the believers and chaste women from those who were given the Scripture (Jews and Christians) before your time, when you have given their due mahr (bridal money given by the husband to the wife at the time of marriage), desiring chastity (i.e., taking them in legal wedlock), not committing illegal sexual intercourse, nor taking them as girlfriends. And whosoever disbelieves in the Oneness of Allaah and in all the other Articles of Faith, the fruitless is his work, and in the Hereafter he will be among the losers.” [al-Maa’idah
for details pls see this page; http://63.175.194.25/index.php?formtrans=dgn%3D3%7C&ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&QR=1114
Brother now for what you did you repent from allah the most forgiver and never repeat this sin again that is what repentence mean
Regarding marriage issue we muslims are allowed to marry christian and jew females then why not shiia, only most important thing is that you should learn and practice on true belief and also ask your wife to do same,so that your children also can become good muslims and for all this you will be rewarded by Allah and if by chance due to ignorence you all do not do that then Allah say's at many places in quran that hell-fire is ready for devients
I wonder why Dr. quiser not ready to accept shia as kaafir, kafir means he who rejects,all devient groups (72) are kaafir and will be inhell for ever becouse they are either disbelievers,rejectors,polytheist,pagan , followers of own desiers, and hgypocrates and trangressors too
Disbelief in shia- they do not believe virtue of 1st three khalifa ( established by quraan and hadeeth) and ofenly call them hypocrates
They think Ali (ra) is only successor to prophet
They praises some family members of prophet pbuh and abuse others for eg aaisha (ra) wife of prophet pbuh is mother of believers (see quran) but they don’t believe her mother then they are not believers( in their own words) because aaisha (ra) is mother of BELIEVERS
Rejectors- they reject many authentic hadeeth just because those aheedeth are narrated by some compainions whom they don’t like
They reject many verses of quran reveled in favor of abubakr(ra) umer(ra) and aaisha (ra)
Polytheiusm- they believe that their imams from Ali(ra) till last ( they them self differ about first to last quantity) are alive they hear them ,help them ,listen to their complains,and so on…
Hypocrasy – they think they are onty muslims and their genral public mern are without beard female without viel they are irreguler in salat ,fast and other obligatons of Allah on them so they are not true but only plastic muslims
Examples of Alhazar and hajj are not valid as there are many political issueus involved
Dr.quiserr how can you be so crual to reject opinions of scholers I will suggest you to learn more into this matter because if any one who say’s (intentionally) muslim to a kafir or polytheiest then he has done kufr
Please see question No.9465-4569-20093-7974 on www.islam-qa.com
And also see www.allaahuakbar.net/shiites/index.htm .
may allah guide us to the straight path which is only one- AAMIN
KHALID...
Salam to all!
A little advice to all; i hope members, read and accept other views.
Brother khalid, a few sites does not mean they 'know' everything or they have all the answers.
There are two opinions about the marriage which was started;
1) Not allowed completly, with groups within shias, a general prohibition.
2) Allowed, but those who are not with the main stream group or those who have the similar beliefs.
The brother who asked the question, might i have done somthing wrong, and may allah forgive him as he is the only one who can forgive. Please try and understand both sides.
Please 'put' down members, as they are your fellow muslims. As JBJ says, feelings or emotions change but not the truth. So provide us with evidence and then state your opinion.
Dr Qaisar is away for some, i do not know why! But his theme was, that the main stream are regarded outside the fold of islam, but there are groups which are not. Simple. He means...we cannot give a 'general' verdict, for the other groups which say there is another prophet after the last prophet is clear cut, not muslims, however you try.
So please brother, be careful and remember, if i am falling of a mountain, will you push me?..you have your views! but consider others.
Sadiq! Dont take it the wrong way...but this issue isn't, as you would say...black and white..!
khalid sawani
28-04-2002, 07:40
salam to those who follow guidence
Brother Sadik
I strongly belive it and also my reasearch on shiaism helped me to declare firmly that all groups in shias are from devients , they are grave worshipers, they seek help from dead ones , this way I came to conlusion that
They are mushriks and mushriks are double KAFIR
You know shirk is bigesst sin , we are allowed by mohammed (pbuh) to do kufr when we are forced but never shirk under any conditions not even if burnt alive or cut into pieces
This example falling from mountain and pushing is suitable only in worldy affairs not in religious beliefs If you know truth and don’t make them aware then you are pushing them to HELL and according to hadith by prophet (pbuh) “one inspite knowing truth not declairing it is a dumb saitaan”
I believe that truth is always to be shown and lie must be disclosed to every one ,pampering does not helps in these all issues , this is totally different issue that some kafir needs your help in worldly affaris and you help him ,solve his problems but when it come to right of Allah then Allah deserve more rights then any individual and we have to become strieght forward and totally impartial
This is an open discussion forum any one can drop in and read , so we have to be more clear and specific rearding Allahs words , if they accept then fine and if they reject it then it is upto him and Allah , I am happy performing my duty and this is what Allah wants from us ENJOIN TRUTH AND FORBID EVILS .
Pls don’t say that only those reject last prophet phenomenon is only NON MUSLIM , It not like that pls see my posts in this site http://www.aliasoft.com/htdocs/DCForumID2/71.html under title DEFINATION OF MUSLIM
ACCORDING TO HADITH ALL 72 SECTS IN ISLAM ARE PEOPLE OF HELL EXCEPT ONE
See I do not intend to teach you but Pls try to understand this hadith properly ,
What are the reasons behind their permanent address to hell
1…their shirk ( shirk is not forgvveable)
2….kufr (kafir is also jahahanami for ever)
3…they are hypocrate (they will be in the bottom of hell)
4 .. they hide truth and mix truth with falsehood and lead other innocents to astray
5…they violate rules of Allah and create their own “shariah” in parralael to shariha sent by Allah (this is indirect rejection of last prophets prophethood)
6…they follow their low desires and trangress the Allah’s laws (this is also shirk)
I PRAY ALLHA FOR GUIDENCE AND MERCY FOR ALL
Your brother in Islam
KHALID…
khalid sawani
28-04-2002, 07:46
>salam to those who follow guidence
yes nabeel can marry a shia girl but he will have to learn and practice Quran and sunnah and also make efforts for the girl (his wife) to accept true beliefs of islam and practice them
If he think this is possible for him them he can move ahead or he will be sinner
KHALID...
Salam to all!
I understand your postion...
The thing that i want to get at it is 'the groups within' the main group!
Now everyone knows, the main sect of shias are not regarded as muslims, for there belief of the imamat, the quran, the sahabahs and so on. They are known, and outside the fold of islam, or way of the mountain..so to say.!
But with the lines of Dr qaisar..im just suggessting...can we 'call' all of the groups as outside the fold of islam? There are certain groups which have different beliefs..within the shia areana.
Are they all outside islam? That was the angle, which i was suggesting, to make the topic more intersting...
It is easy to say..the submmitters, the qadiany (dont know how to spell it) are known for thier departure..of islam by saying there is another prophet.! So that is clear.!
but the shias dont say that, meaning all!
Just my words..! Be calm..! And i know the issue of 72 groups.!
Sadiq
khalid sawani
30-04-2002, 12:12
Salam to all! WHO FOLLOW GUIDENCE
YES SHIAS ARE IN UMMAH AMONG 72
they do not bring theory of another prophet like ahmedyas ( quadianees) but becoz of their rejaection of many true Hadeeth and do according to their own wills they are also same as their are rejecting prophet(pbuh)
meaning of hadith of Prophet (pbuh) that one who rejects my saying is rejecing my prophethood and those who reject my prophethood will not enter in jannah
see brother the issue of tackling (calling him to truth) with shia is very hard and needs too much patience and knowledge becoz they include political matters into DEEN very smartly and try to creat lot of confusion
but when you will talk with them on SHIRK then they are unanswerable
IT IS OUR DUTY TO CALL THEM WISELY TO TRUTH
I PRAY ALLAH FOR GUIDENCE OF ALL
KHALID...
servant_of_Allah
30-04-2002, 17:16
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 30-04-02 AT 05:18 PM (GMT)]Assalamu Alaykum Wa Rahmatullah to everyone on the thread !
I would like to apologize to Brother Qaisar for the delay in my response. I would also like to make corrections to, what i believe, are mistakes made by a couple of people on the thread. And Allah knows best.
First, i'd like to respond to Brother Qaisar
"This is true that the Shias are a divided lot but if one were to read the scholarly 'fatwas' regarding their status as kaafirs, they do not make any distinction between the sub-sects of the Shias. One would be constrained to conclude that it applies to Shias in general unless stated otherwise. The scholars would have to make this clear but I guess their fatwas pertain to the main sect, the Ithnaa Asharis. I do not know whether the other minor sects believe likewise. As in all matters, Allah knows best!"
Well, let us take the example of the fatwa by Imam Maalik :
"Abu `Urwa al-Zubayri narrated: We were with Malik ibn Anas when they mentioned a certain man who would find fault with the Companions of the Messenger of Allah. When he heard this, Malik recited the verse: "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him. . ." until he reached the words "delighting the sowers - that He may enrage the disbelievers with (the sight of) them." (48:29) Then Malik said: "Whoever among the people has become one who harbors spite towards any one of the Prophet's Companions, this verse has targeted and reached him."
Imam Maalik said 'whoever'. So, i believe that there should be no confusion with regards to the fatwa.
As far as i am aware, Zaydi Shias do not harbour hatred for the Sahabaah. And, i am not aware of any scholar of Islam passing a fatwa of kufr against them.
"Brother, this isn't a question of what is written on the passports but, rather, very fundamental to beliefs. But we do know where the majority of shias come from, say from Iran. Also passports are a requirement of this century; Shias have been performing the Hajj & Umra since ages, right from the earliest division. The point being that if you give them (or any group) the latitude of performing this most basic of duties for the sake of Allah, then you must also show the same latitude in all other matters; in other words, give them the 'benefit of doubt', so as to say. Is it not for Allah to judge?? Has Allah not promised us all in the Qur'an that He will judge on the Day of Judgement and inform us of our differences?? Why should we pre-empt the judgement? "
Indeed, Allah Will judge us all. Glory be to Allah.
With regards to allowing Shias to come for Hajj in the past. Firstly, i wonder how they would have identified that so and so person is Shia. Wouldn't it have been much more difficult back then?
Nevertheless, let us consider the main sub-sect of the Shias, i.e. the Ithnaa Asharis. There is, as far as i am aware, and Allah knows best, difference of opinion amongst scholars regarding the Ithnaa Asharis.
"This is the present day situation; the shias have been performing the pigrimages since the beginning. The Khalifas (here, I don't refer to the first 4) could have stopped them from doing so at a time when the shias were well organised & concentrated in Iran. But in the end, what purpose is solved by declaring the Shias as kafirs?? Can we punish them? It is only for Allah to either punish His slaves or to forgive them!!! Do we relieve ourselves of some burden?? And what about our own sins???"
A believer is a believer, and a disbeliever is a disbeliever. It is necessary to point out the kufr of a kafir so that people are careful. And Allah knows best.
I do agree, our sins are so many, Subhan Allah. May Allah forgive all the believers, Ameen.
Now, i'd like to address some of the posts that have appeared on this thread.
Brother Qaisar was talking about confusion with regards to fatwas on Shias, since, some of these fatwas merely mentioned 'Shias' and did not deal with each sub-sect, within the Shia sect, individually.
I believe that some members who participated on this thread, are guilty of not having dealt with each sub-sect individually. Their guilt, however, is that they said "Shias are Muslims".
Such statements also create confusion, as they do not deal with each sub-sect individually. These statements are not helpful, and i believe we should refrain from them, just as we should refrain from making statements such as "Shias are kafirs".
One has to study the beliefs of each sub-sect, before passing any fatwa about them
For those who say "Shias are Muslims". They are saying, all Shias are Muslims. I would like to ask these people, what about those Shias who curse the Mother of the Believers, Aisha (RA). There is ijma on the fact that whoever curses Aisha (RA) is a kafir.
So, i would like to ask these people, what do you have to say with regards to this? Remember, there is ijma.
There is a sub-sect, within the Shia sect, which believes that prophethood belonged to Ali (RA), but angel Jibril (AS) made a mistake, and gave it to Prophet Muhammed (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him).
Astagfarullah, astagfarullah !
I seek refuge in Allah.
I testify that there is no god but Allah and i testify that Muhammed is the Messenger of Allah.
What do those people, who make statements such as "Shias are Muslims" have to say now? This is why it is necessary that we deal with each sub-sect of Shias individually.
As for those who say that all Shias are kafirs. I only have to ask them, what about the Zaydi Shias. They are the closest to Ahlus Sunnah, and as far as i am aware, no Muslim scholar passed a fatwa of kufr against them.
Then, how do some people say that "All Shias are kafirs"?
Who has more knowledge, the scholars or us (who are not even scholars)?
May Allah forgive me, Ameen.
Wassalamu Alaykum,
servant of Allah.
khalid sawani
01-05-2002, 06:48
>Assalamu Alaykum Wa Rahmatullah to THOSE WHO FOLLOW GUIDENCE
BROTHER
PLS LET ME KNOW THE BELIEFS OF "ZAYDI SHIAS" FIRST THEN AND THEN ONLY WE CAN MOVE AHEAD
pls include everything (max) in their belief i.e. their belief, their scholers,their mainbooks , their time and land of existence and rise, their differences with their main sect(ithna ashri- the 12),their fastivals, their scholers opinion about books like bukhari,muslim ,ibnmaja tirmizi etc
pls get me as much as possible details so we can discusse
you have mentioned only one sect closer to ahlus sunnah
so we shall discuss on to it]
if u find more sub sects then also pls let me know about them in detailts
wassalm
KHALID..
Jacqueline
06-06-2002, 06:17
salams
As a shia with the large majority of my friends being sunni, alot of debates come up, and unfortunately they might cause friction even with the tightest of friends,,,,you said you're 17,,you're young it is possible for you to surpass these differences but it's not easy, shias believe in the infalibility of the 12 imams and sunnis strongly criticize that,,, once you learn more about Islam you will know whether you would be able to compromise amongst eachother.
The best way to learn about Islam is not through asking people it's by doing the research yourself and take it from an experienced person it will NOT happen over night.
I wish you the best of best of luck,,,but make sure it's true love and not just puppy love.
wasalams
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