View Full Version : Christianity compared the Jewish religion
Netcurtains
02-02-2002, 16:01
LAST EDITED ON 02-02-02 AT 09:10 PM (GMT)[p]There are odd events in the Bible and the Torah
that are not often explored.
In the Torah (old testament) "god" kills all the
first born babies in Egypt. The Jews escape this
fate and flee to Israel.
In the Bible (new testament) "herod" kills all the
first born babies in bethlehem. Jesus escapes this
fate and flees to Egypt.
The implication here is "herod" is being compared
to the Jewish "god". Is the Christian god a different
god to the Jewish god? If not why not?
Any views here?
I would also like to point out that there is no
historic evidence that either event happened.
this being said both stories might be of symbolic
significance rather than history. However, either
way you look at it, there is a parallel here.
There are some significant differences between what happened in the Old Testament and what happened in the New.
First of all, in the Old Testament God allowed the angel of death to kill the firstborn of the Egyptians or of whoever did not trust in Him, but only after giving ample warning and opportunities to save themselves. They had no less than nine significant plagues ahead of time, which should have convinced anybody that the Hebrews had God on their side. In fact, many Egyptians joined the Hebrews in their flight from Egypt. I would have to research it a little more to recall if it was actually God who did the killing, or if He simply allowed it to happen. Most of the time it's a moot point, but in this discussion it could be significant.
By contrast, in the New Testament, there was no warning or opportunity for salvation given. It was just immediate, swift death (or at least, as fast as Herod's soldiers could get to Bethlehem).
There could be some parallels here, but I think it's mostly concidence in the stories. Certainly nowhere in the Bible are any analogies drawn between Herod and God. Comparisons could just as easily be drawn between Herod and the Pharoah of Egypt, after all, since he commanded that the male children of the Hebrews be put to death.
Netcurtains
04-02-2002, 09:39
LAST EDITED ON 04-02-02 AT 01:38 PM (GMT)[p]I do not think it justified to kill babies
with or without warnings. Babies have
done no wrong. I do not think it justified
to let it happen either.
However, britian bombed germany in the war
(dresden) and of course the allies bomb
afghanistan. Babies die in these bombing raids.
We have just wars and babies die in them.
There would appear to be no black or white
just shades of grey. We all try to pick our grey
that appears to us to be the nearest to white.
Babies die in hospitals every day - unfortunately.
>I do not think it justified
>to kill babies
>with or without warnings. Babies have
>
>done no wrong. I do not
>think it justified
>to let it happen either.
In human terms, I would agree with you. But I do not stand in judgment of God, either.
>
>However, britian bombed germany in the
>war
>(dresden) and of course the allies
>bomb
>afghanistan. Babies die in these bombing
>raids.
>We have just wars and babies
>die in them.
Don't forget all the people who try to attack us all the time! It's a sad day, isn't it, when people target even innocent children for destruction.
>
>There would appear to be no
>black or white
>just shades of grey. We all
>try to pick our grey
>
>that appears to us to be
>the nearest to white.
Actually, I think there is definitely a black and a white, a right and a wrong, otherwise every moral value is up for negotiation.
>
>Babies die in hospitals every day
>- unfortunately.
But not deliberately, of course.
Netcurtains
05-02-2002, 09:52
LAST EDITED ON 05-02-02 AT 11:29 AM (GMT)[p]people keep saying that phrase "you think you know more then god".
Let me tell you something - I personally believe Joseph knew more carpentary then god. I personally believe Mary knew more about being a mother then god.
god asked the croud "who touched me" - because he did not know.
The first words god said to adam - "where are you?" - Adam knew and god did not.
then god said "who told you that you where naked?" - Adam knew god did not.
then he wanted to know what they ate - Adam knew god did not.
Netcurtains
05-02-2002, 12:38
and another point:
If I understand my biology correctly (and my kids),
we first become aware that we are naked and shy about
7 or 8 or 9.
Thus Adam and Eve were probably only very young kids.
What sort of parent leaves young kids in a garden with
a dangerous snake and then kicks them out for being
naughty. To my mind that makes god a bad parent.
Today God would end up in prison for behaving like that.
what are your views?
LAST EDITED ON 05-02-02 AT 02:53 PM (GMT)[p]Greetings Netcurtain!
I do not believe that Joseph knew more about carpentry than God, or that Mary knew more about mothering than God. God knows everything.
Christians claim that in Jesus, God assumed human nature. God emptied himself and assumed the limitations of being fully human. As fully human, it is quite possible that Jesus did not have conscious, verbal, thematic omniscience. Just as I know things non-verbally (like how to type), and I know things "unconsciously" (such as when I am trying to place a name with a face), so too, Jesus may have had limitations on his human conscious and verbal knowledge.
Thus, I would agree with you that it is possible that Joseph knew more about carpentry than Jesus knew while he walked the earth. And Mary may have knew more about mothering than Jesus knew in his humanity. Again -- this is just a possibility. There have been theologians who argue that Jesus was the perfect man in every way, such that he was the best doctor, best engineer, best carpenter, etc...who ever lived.
Regarding your original question, you are correct that there is a sparcity of historical evidence for the two events you raise (the death of the first born under pharoah, and Herod's slaying the children of Bethlehem). However, we know from Josephus that the actions described by Luke regarding Herod are consistent with this tyrant, and Bethlehem was a small town, such that the event may not have been as widely recorded as other atrocities by this mad-man. In regards to Egypt, not all the research is in -- we are discussing events that happened over 3,000 years ago, and much more archeological study remains to be done.
Regarding the parrallel between YHWH and Herod, I don't really see it. First of all, God is perfectly just and perfectly merciful. It is quite possible that he took the children in both incidences straight to heaven. However, as Tita pointed out, in the case of Egypt, there was plenty of warning and the death of the first born was the result of an injustice -- slavery and the Egyptian act of killing the first born Jews!
In the case of Herod, we have a lunatic who is so frightened of losing political power that he slays innocent children to protect his throne. According to Josephus, Herod also slew his own sons and committed many other heinious crimes against humanity.
The real parrallel is that the death of the first born foreshadows Christ's death on the cross, which is the perfect satisfaction of justice before the accuser (Satan). In Christ, God puts an end once and for all to the need for blood sacrifices.
Peace and Blessings!
jcecil3
alhamdliyesua
05-02-2002, 20:37
um...Herod is compared to the Pharoah, not G-d.
alhamdliyesua
05-02-2002, 20:40
did you ever think that G-d would ask a retorical question to convict Adam and Eve of there sin?
G-d knows all; he uses retorical questions not to gain knowledge but to show us who we truly are.
shalom
Netcurtains
05-02-2002, 22:19
Hi,
Of course I thought of that.
However, that made it worse!
Because you either ask those sort of questions
to young children or to adults that you are
laughing at.
Thus my point about Adam and Eve being
about 9 is valid-ish.
These are the sort of questions relgious people
(from all religions) are going to have to
explain to an ever increasingly sceptical
world.
Hello to all of you who have been participating on this thread !
Despite being told repeatedly that this is an Islamic Discussion Forum and we do not allow preaching of religions other than Islam, all of you seem not to care.
Why do almost all Christians, in my experience, have such a difficult time obeying rules and laws? Not a very law-abiding people it seems.
You are all being strictly warned not to break the rules of this site, as you have been doing on a number of occasions in the past, and have still not paid heed to our advice.
Henceforth, action will be taken if you all do not discontinue.
Thank you,
Asif.
Netcurtains
06-02-2002, 09:41
Asif,
You must change the NAME of this BB! From Comparative - to NOT COMPARATIVE. I've STOPPED talking about Christianity on all other threads - I ASSUMED (wrongly) that this was the COMPARATIVE BB?
NettY
I'm not sure that it's possible to answer questions about your religion without coming across as "preaching." If you feel that I have been preaching so far, I will be glad to withdraw from this forum (are you one of the administrators, BTW?) But please note, I have been responding to questions posted by Muslims. If you don't want to have those questions answered, they shouldn't be asked to begin with.
alhamdliyesua
07-02-2002, 00:50
What exactly is a comparative religion forum?
Are you afraid, Asif? People who seek the truth will find it.
We are a zealous people just like you. Jesus is our life and we won't leave Him out of our conversation. We've respectfully taken ourselves to the COMPARATIVE RELIGION FORUM. (for Comparative Relgion talks, right?)
Have peace.
seekeroftruth
08-02-2002, 01:49
Salam to all!
Now as netcurtains and everyone should know, comparative section is to compare religions, right?
Now this thread (above) is it comparing religions. Tell me, how?
This is an Islamic site, and mashallah has many sections such as current affairs, poem section and like this one a comparative section. If there was a question regarding Islam and Christianity or Islam and Judaism and so forth, it a should be asked in this forum, right?. Is that similar to the above thread?.
Remember I said ‘ISLAM’ first! The reason being, it is a Islamic site, if you want to compare religions then it should be Islam with another religion, right?
Tell me if a ford (car company) worker with couple of mates, went to a BMW centre, and they started to talk about the ford car, the inside, the interior, the features and so on. Without anyone asking about it, how do you think the BMW crew will feel?
If you want to discuss Christianity with other Christians, then there is a time and a place, the place being another Christianity site, discussion board. If you are here to talk about the similarities or the differences with Islam and Christianity, then there lies no problem.
Comparing religions or not? But shouldn’t islam be compared with along another religion, as this is what? An Islamic site?
Scared? Now now, subhnallah, what should I or brother asif or even the muslim members be scared of?, please do tell us!
Or is there a new scheme to change mosques into churches (isn’t it the other way round, nowadays) (stating a fact, not attacking anyone)
Please do try and visit an mosque, every week I find another new muslim brother in the mosque learning about Islam. I have met/talked/seen brothers who are professors, doctors, own chip shops, some from china, some from usa, some are tall, some are short and so on, so be scared of what exactly?
Sadiq! Sharing some words!! If my words are incorrect in any way (admin) then please do correct me and I hope to learn from my mistakes.
LASt post from me, for now! dont shed any tears anyone, assignments, assignments and exams and shopping and stuff. So i hope to come back soon, inshallah, dont miss me!!
Look to this day! Yesterday is but a dream, and tomorrow is only a vision. But today, well-lived, makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a vision of hope. - Brother SadiQ
Well, if anyone asks a question about comparing any religion with any other, I will be happy to try to answer, whether Islam with Christianity, Hindu with Mormonism, or any other combination you can think of. Perhaps a new rule should be posted for this thread section: "You can only start a thread on this part of the board if you are comparing Islam to something else." If that was the intent of this section of the board, it should be more clearly stated, don't you think?
Netcurtains
08-02-2002, 09:51
LAST EDITED ON 08-02-02 AT 08:57 AM (GMT)[p]Don't give in - its a wind up by a CONTROL FREAK.
Its their loss if we get banned not ours.
Look at that Seekeroftruth (yeah thats a laugh) - 95% of his posts (perhaps 100%) are about war, hate violence. that is the reverse of religion. He should be banned and or sued for causing racial and relgious tension. I'm sure some of his posts are breaking some laws or are bordering on it.
I wonder way no muslim is willing to give us their tales as to how they ended up being muslim? Is it fear? Do they have a reason? Come on guys - if you want to convert someone then you have to tell them YOUR tale.
Netcurtains
08-02-2002, 11:19
I have been posting on both these boards very similiar
arguments. The Unicorn board is athiests.
From the responses so far its easy to say which religion
has responded the best. Athiests clearly have a better sense of humour (I think their moderators are very funny - I loved their PUBHHHHs). If I had to chose (at present - judging only on the two sites I'd say I'd have to follow the Unicorn Rather then Islam)? Come on lads try harder!!
Judge for yourselves:
My Atomic Theory:
http://pub90.ezboard.com/finstituteforunicornresearchfrm1.showMessage?topic ID=91.topic
My Democratic Theory:
http://pub90.ezboard.com/finstituteforunicornresearchfrm1.showMessage?topic ID=88.topic
My TV and General Science:
http://pub90.ezboard.com/finstituteforunicornresearchfrm4.showMessage?topic ID=11.topic
My Cancer Research Ad:
http://pub90.ezboard.com/finstituteforunicornresearchfrm7
My Krishna Beating Up McDonalds:
http://pub90.ezboard.com/finstituteforunicornresearchfrm12.showMessage?topi cID=30.topic
seekeroftruth
08-02-2002, 13:42
>LAST EDITED ON 08-02-02
>AT 08:57*AM (GMT)
>
>Don't give in - its a
>wind up by a CONTROL
>FREAK.
>Its their loss if we get
>banned not ours.
Really? How does one become banned? rules are their to be obeyed. Same for you and me.
>Look at that Seekeroftruth (yeah thats
>a laugh) - 95% of
>his posts (perhaps 100%) are
>about war, hate violence. that
>is the reverse of religion.
Really? Then again, i post news on the war, for all to read. Iam not changing because of someone or something. I am sadiq. All my posts?, so you have gone thorugh all my posts? you do have alot of time on your hand!1
>He should be banned and
>or sued for causing racial
>and relgious tension. I'm sure
>some of his posts are
>breaking some laws or are
>bordering on it.
Why? I dont think you are in a postion to say that. The Admin are there to look after the site, thats why they are called 'admin'.
>I wonder way no muslim is
>willing to give us their
>tales as to how they
>ended up being muslim? Is
>it fear? Do they have
>a reason? Come on guys
>- if you want to
>convert someone then you have
>to tell them YOUR tale.
I am a born muslim, so it does not matter. There are certain brothers that i know, ill tell them to join and tell thier stories.
So netty? you are trying to be an admin!!
TITA! > If you have anything, sugesstions or anything concerning this forum then contact the admin.!!
sadiQ!!
Look to this day! Yesterday is but a dream, and tomorrow is only a vision. But today, well-lived, makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a vision of hope. - Brother SadiQ
Netcurtains
08-02-2002, 14:21
come come old son - you have a brain?
You might be BORN a MUSLIM (as I was a Catholic) but
obviously (surely????????) you investigated others?
Have you had no spiritual events in your life - none whatsoever?
I'll tell you a true story about a school down the road.
This will make you laugh.
One day a man, an Islamic cleric came to see a form teacher (age of class about 8). He got upset and said "I can't speak to you I must speak to a man - can I see the head teacher?" She replied "Shes a woman too".
Some points here.
1) What on earth is this man doing in the UK if he can't speak to women????
2) Why do Islamics recruit many of their clerics from rural Pakistan were these guys (as nice as they may be) have not got a clue about britian? They are obviously causing distress to highly educated teaching staff.
Yes I do have too much time - I'm unemployeed thanks to "Islamic" murderers.... write a poem about that.
Hi Netty,
>Don't give in - its a
>wind up by a CONTROL
>FREAK.
>Its their loss if we get
>banned not ours.
I agree it will be their loss, but you could certainly state it more nicely than that.
>
>Look at that Seekeroftruth (yeah thats
>a laugh) - 95% of
>his posts (perhaps 100%) are
>about war, hate violence. that
>is the reverse of religion.
>He should be banned and
>or sued for causing racial
>and relgious tension. I'm sure
>some of his posts are
>breaking some laws or are
>bordering on it.
That is not true. Seekeroftruth has been all right with me, and certainly has not advocated violence that I have seen. He's a conspiracy theorist par excellent, but he can believe that stuff if he wants.
As for banning and being sued, that is not exactly free speech either, is it? And he has broken no laws that I know of. And if he is, according to what jurisdiction? We don't even know what country he's from.
>
>I wonder way no muslim is
>willing to give us their
>tales as to how they
>ended up being muslim? Is
>it fear? Do they have
>a reason? Come on guys
>- if you want to
>convert someone then you have
>to tell them YOUR tale.
I have read many such tales, though not necessarily on this site. They will happily tell you if they ask, but I don't recommend doing that unless you want a l-o-n-g answer.
There are one or two people on this site who scare me, but seekeroftruth is not one of them. Please be a little nicer to him.
Tita
"TITA! > If you have anything, sugesstions or anything concerning this forum then contact the admin.!!
sadiQ!!"
I already have, thanks. The same should apply to you, should it not? I mean, if we are out of line, shouldn't you bring those concerns to the admin? I have written directly to Om_Mohammed about this and am awaiting his reply.
Netcurtains
08-02-2002, 21:11
LAST EDITED ON 08-02-02 AT 08:14 PM (GMT)[p]you're probably right.
Om_Mohammed
09-02-2002, 07:49
Assalaamu alaikum ya muslimeen.
Greetings and good day to all.
The ongoings of this forum has been brought to my attention by a personal email I received from the participant 'Tita'. I would like to elaborate on several simple points to keep in mind for all concerned, muslims and non-muslims alike.
Firstly, we not only expect, but demand of all desiring participants to uphold the best of conduct in behaviour and interaction with each other, including a general atmosphere of tolerance and patience and kindness. That is not to say that all must agree...for surely that is not possible. Even those of the same basic religious beliefs will not always agree on all topics. But a basic and general atmosphere of tolerance and civility is the trademark of this site. We have a great reputation on this internet of such a civil manner of representation, and we are determined to keep it that way, inshaAllah.
So, a reminder to all that no matter what your personal opinions or beliefs may be, that a basic sense of respect and kindness to others is the utmost practice which will therefore enable you to adhere to the rules of this site.
In respect to this reminder, I would personally like to thank Tita, among others, for upholding such a format of posting.
As we expect no insults towards Islam, so the same is concerned in retrospect towards any other religion...i.e. no insulting of other religions as well. There is a fine line between comparing between religions, and insulting one another and leading to a non-return from a war zone of flying insults back and forth.
As well, there is a fine line between comparing between religions, and preaching a religion. And, although it may not seem fair to the non-muslims participating here, there is no restriction of preaching Islam here, while there is certainly a major and definite restriction of preaching any other religion. It is fine to compare between the religions, but beware of getting into preaching your religion in the process. As I said, there is a fine line, so do not cross it. If no action has yet been taken against you in this respect, then it is safe to assume that you have not yet crossed that line, in the judgement of the moderator of this forum, and the judgement of the administration of this site as well.
As this thread has become rather long, and is moving towards the state of confusion, I humbly suggest that any further postings along this line be started under another thread heading.
Thankyou for your participation.
One last warning of reminder to 'netcurtains': although you are treading this 'fine line' of insulting towards muslims and Islam, and you are for the moment still technically within your boundaries of obeying our designated rules, I am warning you that your total approach to debate and discussion here is in the manner of expressing your hate and spreading hate for Islam. This is not the purpose of this forum or any other forum on this site. For you, 'net', as well as for others, please try to contain your hate, and carry on a civil and well-mannered debate method.
It is not, by the way, the fault of all muslims that you happened to lose your job because of your impression due to 'Islamists', as you have termed them. The correct term is 'muslims', not 'islamists'.
For your information, we have adopted a policy of no-tolerance for hate messages, or those who like to spread their feelings of hate, only to incur hate-filled or angered responses. Actually, it is the policy of this site since this site has come into existence. Only a reminder of the continuation of said policy. Therefore, according to this policy, all such messages are and will be deleted, as well as those registered who are posting in such manner face the possibility of bannment. And, by the way, it is no loss to us for banning such persons.
All are welcome, regardless of their religious preference. But not the hate mongers.
Thankyou.
Om Mohammed.
Hello Tita
"If you feel that I have been preaching so far, I will be glad to withdraw from this forum (are you one of the administrators, BTW?) But please note, I have been responding to questions posted by Muslims. If you don't want to have those questions answered, they shouldn't be asked to begin with."
Read this entire thread. Were you discussing Islam?
Answer: no.
Were you asking questions about Islam?
Answer: no.
Was a Muslim asking questions to you?
Answer: no.
Were you asking questions to Muslims?
Answer: no.
And what do you say: " I have been responding to questions posted by Muslims". Interesting.......
Where you do respond to questions posted by Muslims, or where you ask questions to Muslims, i have not asked you to stop.
But i asked you to stop on this thread. This thread is discussing Christianity and Judaism, not Islam. That is why i asked everyone here that if they wish to discuss Christianity and Judaism, they can do so elsewhere, not here, since this is an Islamic Discussion Forum. Even if you read the description of the Comparitive Religion Forum, the very first line says "Islam and other religions".
Even the rules of the site clearly state that you cannot preach religions other than Islam. And on this thread, that is exactly what is being done.
Also, i was speaking with respect to this particular thread, and that is why the message was posted here.
And, no, i am not an administrator. I have read your objections about me asking you to stop. Therefore, i will clarify the way things work on Aliasoft, so that you can understand better.
On Aliasoft, we have a governing body, called the Shuraa Council, which takes decisions like banning people, or changing rules, etc. Members of the Shuraa Council are from various parts of the world. Some are moderators, and some aren't. Similarly, not all moderators are members of this council.
Even administrators consult this council before going ahead and taking decisions like banning someone, or changing rules. They do not do it on their own.
We also have a Moderators council, dealing with matters that ought to be discussed between moderators.
Also, one beautiful feature about Aliasoft is, that all of us moderators help each other. I expect (and certainly have received) help in moderating my forums, and the other moderators also receive help in moderating their forums. Helping each other is what we believe in, and how things work here, Alhamdulilah.
More importantly, we even ask the participants to help us moderate the forums (Alert feature).
I have only mentioned all this to you, so that you know how things work here.
And, i do not have any problem with your behaviour, so do not worry. It is other people who i am unhappy about.
Bye,
Asif.
P.S. Om Mohammed is a Sister. Her name means "Mother of Mohammed".
Netcurtains
09-02-2002, 10:43
I think you are both taking the micky and being over the top and pompous! lol.
1) I do not hate the muslim religion. I put "islamics" in quotes because even though the killers thought of themselves as muslim I know the vast majority of UK muslims do not respect them.
I hate much of the Arabic PRESS as they print lies.
Fancy implying the pope wants a crusade. sick! I'm not against the Islamic faith but I am against (as all democratic people are) anything that infringes human rights. Many Islamic nations do.
2) Preach or Debate - I think you're going to have to bin the distinction - its fundamentally ridiculous. Preach means the non-islamic is winning a particular debate. It doesn't mean they have in reality - its just my grasp of that particular subject might be deeper then my "opponent".
3) Comparing two non-islamic religions helps put Islam in prospective. I would say if this happened on a Christian BB it would be allowed without any difficulty. What would happen , would be a christian would probably add their two pennys worth.
4) Light and airy. Look at the trouble there is in the UK at present - You're all going to have to get some more HUMOUR in here .
5) I obviously has some points otherwise this site would be buzzing with Muslim writers - where are they all????
Cheers Netty (don't take yourselves too seriously - I certainly don't take myself seriously - my grasp of religion tiny - lighten up)
Your problem, netty, is that you obviously do not take things so seriously. We muslims, at least those present here at these forums, on the other hand, do take all this quite seriously. It is, in fact, a matter of eternal life or death and destruction. If you really want the humour, then go back to your christian bb's, or your humour sites, or whatever you choose. If you want seriousness, and to learn truly about islam, then you are most welcome here.
Lulua.
LAST EDITED ON 13-02-02 AT 01:56 AM (GMT)[p]Demystifying God (see full version at Tech Exchange-Welcome)
In this 21st Century, the Age of Technology, we are still plagued by religious beliefs that may be a contributing cause of terrorism, killings and wars between nations. Belief in a God who causes catastrophes, punishes people and who created the universe out of nothing as if by magic, was brought about by hysteria and superstition. This thought process needs to be reassessed and brought up to date. Open-minded people must use common sense to determine whether this God was incorrectly perceived, misinterpreted and misunderstood by the masses of a bygone era.
The destruction of civilizations, most sufferings and premature deaths are due to our frailties, our stupidity or human imperfections, not God's or the Devil's doings. The greatest fallacy is beliefs that split people, religions and countries. Too many lives have been lost in an illogical attempt to force our beliefs on others.
When people first acquired reasoning abilities, the first fear of an unseen deity came about when lightning and thunder caused them to cringe and seek shelter. Lightning and thunder were thought to be punishment from God for evil deeds. Worshipping God through prayers and asking for forgiveness eventually, as the storm passed, was believed to appease the wrath of God or the Gods.
Prophets of past who claimed to have a personal contact with God, had been inspired by God, thereby interpreting this ecstasy to the best of their ability; and applying this wisdom to a time when it was believed that a holy man had to have direct contact with God; today we know that interactions between dimensions is not a reality. This God will not strike you dead with a lightning bolt or condemn you to eternal hell fire and damnation if you do not follow the teachings of your fathers or spiritual leaders, or pray to him constantly. This was a war-like god. He was as necessary at that time as every king, dictator, war lord, and tribal leader who fought and died by the sword. The God of Abraham, Moses, Noah, Jesus and other Prophets, is the same as the God of today. God will not interfere with anything that is done on earth.
Are you an atheist?
Tayeb
Tayeb, apparently you have not completely read my post. My interpretation of God may vary from yours, but as surely as I know that there is a God, I know that my soul will be a part of God after my physical demise.
I apologize for subjecting many who read my posting to lengthy dialogue and hereby summarize it. Those who question it, please reread the entire text and then your critiques are welcome.
Human fallibility and misconceptions have labeled God for past millenniums as one who interferes with the natural forces and free will of people by threatening punishment to those who disobey his bidding.
God is the Pure Collective Intelligence Of Souls existing in a spiritual realm and does not interfere with anything on earth or in the universe.
There are several levels of consciousness.
On a scale of 1 to 10 rating, with consciousness being level 1 where the spirit accumulates data and triggers emotions. The upper level of subconsciousness is at level 2; involuntary subconscious reactions are sometimes manifested. The dream level at 3; a series of thoughts and visions are introduced. Level 4 is deep sleep. Hibernation is at level 5. At level 6 unconsciousness sets in. Spiritual data is stored between levels 6 and 9. At 10 the subconscious is at a point of physical imminent death, whereupon the soul aura enters the spiritual realm. Kirlian photography which was invented in Russia, enables pictures of the aura to be taken.
When a personality disorder affects the data input process, data is filtered. Brain injury does not supersede the soul, at that point data input simply ceases.
>There are several levels of consciousness.
>
>
>On a scale of 1 to
>10 rating, with consciousness being
>level 1 where the spirit
>accumulates data and triggers emotions.
>The upper level of subconsciousness
>is at level 2; involuntary
>subconscious reactions are sometimes manifested.
>The dream level at 3;
>a series of thoughts and
>visions are introduced. Level 4
>is deep sleep. Hibernation is
>at level 5. At level
>6 unconsciousness sets in. Spiritual
>data is stored between levels
>6 and 9. At 10
>the subconscious is at a
>point of physical imminent death,
>whereupon the soul aura enters
>the spiritual realm. Kirlian photography
>which was invented in Russia,
>enables pictures of the aura
>to be taken.
>
>When a personality disorder affects the
>data input process, data is
>filtered. Brain injury does not
>supersede the soul, at that
>point data input simply ceases.
>
Grettings to all!!
This is a reminder for you, this is the description of this forum;
"..Comparative Religion = Islam and other religions, a dialogue between faiths around the World. Comparative religion, and the role of Islam in different societies where Islam is in majority or minority. An ideal place for discussion dealing with Jesus and the Bible. .."
Now your above post or theme is not 'comparing' anything. Whether islam or islam with other religions. If you want to talk about dimensions and stuff, there is a time and a place, but not here.
Thankyou and i hope others read the description of the board before entering it, ok?
Take care.
Sadiq!
-------------------------------
"Oh Allah, enrich me with knowledge, adorn me with gentleness, honour me with piety and beautify me with health", Aameen
vancouver
18-03-2002, 20:39
They were not all babies(Egyptians). First born remember(small percentage would have been babies,most would have been adults). The Egyptians were not a likeable race at that time. Remember God had chosen Isreal and made them special. The other nations did not have this priviledge as a nation but they could become Isrealites by religion if they wanted to. The other nine plagues should have been enough for Egypt but their leader was a tough nut and put himself above God. They deserved what they got from the true God whom they did not believe existed.There was no comparrison at all to what Herod did without provocation.
vancouver
18-03-2002, 20:43
Most Catholics are born and then die without a thought about whether or not they have the truth. Its drummed into them that much during youth that they are frightened to look elsewhere. Hell fire seems to be the frightening force behind it.
vancouver
18-03-2002, 20:53
Everyone should be able to make a defense for their beliefs. It should be done in a calm manner without causing undue hurt to those that question ones beliefs.
The biggest threat to ones beliefs is apathy, not persecution for those beliefs.
Netcurtains
18-03-2002, 21:09
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 18-03-02 AT 10:16 PM (GMT)]exactly (in 3rd world of course).
PS - I've now got a job. In the airline industry.
However I still blame fundamentalism (of all shades - protestant, hindu, muslim and catholic) for much of the problems in this world.
Let me tell you a few home truths Vanny ....
When Christianity was at its height - St Paul and St Peter and St Mary were "winging it" - it was changing and evolving almost weekly.
The bible - IMHO is still being written. I'm "winging it" as best I can to suit the circumstance I'm in - which were not that good until about 4 weeks ago.
Jesus was killed by Fundamentalists that is a FACT!
Funamentalists thought Jesus claimed to be "king" and "god" - "the King of the Jews" and "god". So what if he did - does that give them the right to kill him?
You wonder why I get cross? Its because people are dying, people are enslaved, people are stuck in ruts - wake up and follow your dreams - hitch your wagon and ride towards the rainbow - life is an adventure - wing it!
A million people died in Rwanda - allegedly a Catholic Priest might have been involved. Allegedly the catholic authorities have been trying to protect him from prosecution (he has since been extradited).
This is a catholic web site and bb (no cover up here):
http://www.zpub.com/un/pope/cath2.html
Saints are probably mildly athiestic people living in 3rd World Countries or mildly religious people living in the hedonist 1st World Countries.
Do we believe we evolved from apes? I think this is correct.
servant_of_allah I really would like you to understand why the religious authorities had jesus killed and then compare this to
your views on blasphemy. What would YOU do?
vancouver
19-03-2002, 01:57
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 19-03-02 AT 00:57 AM (GMT)]If Jesus or someone like him came in our midst today the same thing would happen all over again. The world is much more corrupt and unclean morally now than it has ever been and those in this mode form the majority of the world's population so such a physical man would not have a chance. The fact is that when Christ fully returns he will not be in human form but as a spirit creature with mighty power. This time he really will destroy the governments on the earth that are all afflicting mankind to their injury. Whether it be democracy, republican, totalitarian, communistic, all will share the same fate.
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